JFSebastion was THERE. He worked at a RECORD STORE.

Whatever Juju Elton sprinkled over the song, it went to the top of the charts. There is nothing after that song that would have topped the charts, except for , sadly his assassination. Double Fantasy was sliding down the charts as was the song Starting Over. His death brought out all the ghouls that feast on dead flesh. True fans like us had already bought it..

I don't think that's fair, as the album had only been out 3 weeks when John died.

I'm sure a lot of "true fans" planned to get it for Xmas 1980.

"True fan" designations seem pointless to me anyway. I mean, not everyone had spare cash to buy every album as soon as it hit the shelves.

I did get it before John's death, but I was 13 so it wouldn't have meant I was a "ghoul" if I'd waited to get it for Xmas

I worked at a record store. Sales went up after his death. I asked people who were buying it. Half of them were getting it because they it would be worth more after he was killed. If that isn't ghoulish enough, I don't know what is.

Go to Double Fantasy Thread here on Steve Hoffman Forums. It is stated that it was " ghoulish sales" after his death. Conniefrancis is the commentor who also worked in the business. I'm sorry if you've been misled. I was there. Lennon revisionists enjoy all the post death shenanigans, the inflated sales. Geffon records reaped a lot of blood money from the ordeal. It's sad.

Sure sales went up, but 45 was already doing very well, LP I think only had 2weeks on charts before his death. Was Geffen supposed to halt sales?

Classic Rock also has an article on this subject. Lennon's Double Fantasy was being pumped out of the Record plants in vast numbers. No one had ever been assassinated before John. Elvis's death is the only time numbers for the albums jumped, but not at the levels Double Fantasy did. I'm sorry if I'm telling something you don't want to believe. Doesn't mean it isn't true. Again I was there. We couldn't keep the record on the shelf. Cassettes and 8 tracks sales also shot up, but predominantly it was vinyl that sold. It is said to be the last major vinyl record rush in the first era of vinyl. As sales for vinyl had been steadily declining and would free fall with the advent of CD's.

Of course sales went up after John's death, though despite your anecdotes, I doubt all that many people bought "DF" as an investment, as that made no sense. It wasn't a limited edition - and there wasn't eBay to use to easily profit.

I simply contend it's simplistic - and insulting - to imply that everyone who didn't purchase by 12/8/80 is both a "non-true fan" and a ghoul.

This is the chart run for Starting Over on Billboard until it hit #1. Was #3 when his death was reported. Hardly a failure before his death.

38-32- 10-9-8-6-4-3-*1*

Guess you had to be working a record store at the time to see it. And in one of my posts I mentioned that half the people buying it, were looking for a pot of gold if they bought John's album. I'm sorry it was sick. "Oh I don't care if he died, I just want to make money on this record someday." That kind of attitude.

Maybe you are forgetting the build up, the ferver of fans that hadn't heard from John in 5 years. Forget that the album was shared with Yoko, the fans were hungry. The single Starting Over had airplay from October thru early December. The same Lennon / Beatles fans lined up to buy it without hesitancy. No what I saw after December 8th, wasn't really Lennon fans. This was a phenomena exploding at the seams. The late Lennon Buyers, overshadowed by the also runs, the grandmothers buying the album because they heard he was dead and they thought it was the perfect gift for their granddaughter / son. No it was a $&!+ show from that point on.

It sure was. I went into work at 1pm on December 9th. We had already received 1 shipment of Beatles/Lennon albums
(when our normal shipment day was Friday). The store was jammed with people buying any and every piece of Lennon
related recordings they could get their hands on. After berating a few customers (“WHY ARE YOU BUYING THIS NOW? WHAT GOOD DOES IT DO? BRING HIM BACK? YOU SHOULD HAVE ALWAYS BEEN LISTENING TO THESE RECORDS!!!! etc.) I was exiled to the Ticketron booth for the rest of the day.
Double Fantasy went from brisk sales to a top 5 seller for a few months.

Thank you. Somebody who remembers how it went down. I had no problem with some late Lennon fans , but all those fair weather fans who smelled blood in the water. A chance to turn a buck, and on tragedy like Lennon's. The closest we've come since is Michael Jackson or Prince or Bowie's death but you roll all those together and not come up with Lennon's death scene.

You're missing an important part of my explanation. I was at the counter ringing people up , asking them questions. The first week or so after his death, nearly everyone coming to the register, were clutching a Double Fantasy record.

I'm puzzled by this. How would someone expect to make money by buying Lennon's album? Something that is a big seller is unlikely to have any future value as a collectible.

Most artists have hardcore fans and casual fans. Casual fans don't go out and buy a record on the day of its release. They don't even necessarily buy every record released by the artist. But if the artist dies, it reminds them of the fact that they like the guy, and inspires them to go buy the latest record. That doesn't mean they don't care about the artist and aren't real fans. It's just a reflection of the fact that they aren't hardcore fans.

Grandmothers, mothers of teens that just assumed they listened to John. Truth was that a lot of teens in 1980 had not a care for any of the Ex Beatles, grandma to the rescue. When I asked most people, half of them were buying for profit ( sell later at a much higher price) ,or some for younger relatives. These were not Lennon's fans. I was there! I was selling these albums to people who had no inkling of who John Lennon was. Classic Rock magazine has an article on this phenomena. This very Steve Hoffman Forum has Threads on this subject. Research it yourself.

A person buying a younger relative a record because they think they would like it is not "ghoulish" or "blood money" even if they are wrong about whether their younger relative really does like it. I am puzzled by the fact that you seem to have a problem with these type of sales.

And you can take comfort in the fact that anyone buying a hot-selling album as an investment is an idiot who is not going to make any return on their idiocy.

Already addressed their idiocy. The Lure of money brings out the crazy in people. Good grief, look at ticket scalpers, record flippers. Please keep up. And for the last time I was there. I interacted with most people who bought music at the record store. I've always been curious about society's ticks. Lennon's death and the phenomena that followed had never been seen before in a musicical artist. John Kennedy was the closest to it, but really Apple and oranges

I am glad you were a true fan. That puts you in with me and 1.2 million others that had been buying his albums pretty much sight unseen with his every release.

I'm sorry what I have been relaying in this Thread is upsetting a few people, doesn't mean it didn't happen. The album was slowing, in regards to re orders by our record store and trending that way the week before his death.

December 9th , the morning after I was at the store. Depressed due to having watched the Monday Night Football broadcast the night before and hearing Howard Cowsell blurt out that " John Lennon had been shot, dead on arrival. "

The district manager had called our store from his east coast office saying their phones were ringing off the hook all morning. Frantic calls from people wanting to make sure the stores had a copy of Double Fantasy still on the shelf and to hold a copy for them. He called to say his distributors were combing thru their warehouses and were going to ship us an allotment of what was left.

Sure enough about 11am when we usually started answering the phone, just before we opened, the calls for Double Fantasy started coming in. Once open I spent the rest of the day ringing up customers while the store manager manned the phone. It rang every five minutes, all for the same thing, do you still have Double Fantasy ?

We had i think 14 copies from our second shipment as it had stopped selling the previous Friday. The first week was brisk and the ardent Ex Beatles/ Lennon fans gobbled up the album.

For anyone willing to look at stark numbers , Double Fantasy had sold just above his last albums Rock n Roll, Walls & Bridges and Mind Games. Like most artists on the wane, he sold a certain amount of copies to the diehard fans and after that it would fizzle out. Considering the fact it had been five years since any Lennon new songs were released, he sold over the usual amount, but not much more than .3 million more copies. Had he not have been shot dead, it would have sold better than the previous releases but was not projected to sell " Imagine" type numbers.

So fast forward nearly a week, we received several boxes of Double Fantasy. We had sold the 14 or so copies on the 9th of December. We had sold all but 3 copies of the 2 boxes as "holds " for customers. You know, the ghoulish ones I've not been shy about mentioning.

In closing I can't expect 99 % of the population still alive and were not working in the music business to have any idea what truly went down during those sad and historic weeks after December 8th. After relaying what I saw and people doing a bit of research into the phenomena that his death caused. I would hope it will help. The sales figures on Billboard Charts do look like it was just constantly going up in sales , up unto and after his death, but they were trailing off the weekend before his death. The sales beginning on the 9th of December hid what was a downturn because sales reporting in 1980 were dinosaurian compared to the information age we live in today. I hope this helps you and the others that can't possibly had known what was truly going on behind the record counters all across the country and the world.

In one respect to the difference between Elvis and John, John had just released. Double Fantasy, a new album. If you want to make a direct comparison, Bowie and the Black Star album is much closer to Lennon's Double Fantasy.

As far as ghoulish buyers for Black Star, I'm sure there were many , however I am no longer in the record store business, so I can't comment on that.

We also sold a lot of Beatles albums that December. I didn't see ghoulish people in that regard. Only Double Fantasy seem to be bringing them out. I can't answer your question of whether you're a ghoul or not. Obviously since I've never met you , I could only speculate and I won't do that. No, unless you came to my record store , how could I know who or what you were the day you bought your records. I would rather think you were a true fan and leave it at that.